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You're a bit young to know this but Ajax back then were one of the biggest clubs in the World and best sides, think Holland of that era. Germany was two countries back then and we beat the champions of both of them. And again, you didn't get a few games against rigged oppostion to get through,, you got who you got and had to beat them over two legs so couldn't even spawn your way through. Your trouble here is having no context to compare.

 

Yeah, really good points. Also, some of the East European teams were harder opponents than you may think not just because they played to a higher standard than they do these days but also because of the lack of opportunity to scout them. They had the advantage of the element of surprise. Remember the phrase "crack East European squad"? I think that translated as "we know fook all about them but we've just seen them in training and we're starting to wish we'd eaten three Shredded Wheat this morning!".

 

Savo does make some good points about the level of opposition in the Champions League being more consistently good, but old European Cup was not without its pitfalls.

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All I will say, not forgetting the seeding and not being able to play a team from your own country till the quarters, is that it must be easier to win it now because it's SO much easier to get into.

 

Liverpool make the final this season. In the European Cup days, they wouldn't have even been in it. Therefore, it is easier to win.

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There's no point listing obscure teams as though they were the no-hopers they are today 40 years ago. The whole dynamic of European football has changed and the difference in quality between the champions of England and, say Romania would be a lot smaller then than it is now.

 

I'm too young to remember but I think it's safe to assume the champions of Sweden, Romania, East Germany, and especially Holland were usually better teams than the sides that finished 4th in England or Spain.

 

Don't worry Savo, I'm not knocking your team's achievements, you won plenty of times under the old format too. Now back to the Madrid forums with you ;)

Edited by Art Vandelay

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:lol:

 

A forest forum is definitely the wrong place to claim that European football is better nowadays.

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So, Liverpool fans have started a petition for UEFA & FIFA to punish Ramos for his challenge on Salah that forced him off the pitch!!!!

 

Total waste of time comes to mind.

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So, Liverpool fans have started a petition for UEFA & FIFA to punish Ramos for his challenge on Salah that forced him off the pitch!!!!

 

Total waste of time comes to mind.

Always the same with this bunch. Im surprised they havent asked for replay with Real only allowed to pick 8 players and only allowed to play in the middle third of the pitch. Anything that will guarantee them the win. Edited by leather

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:lol:

 

A forest forum is definitely the wrong place to claim that European football is better nowadays.

 

It's just different now than it was then. Firstly you had to win your league to qualify, undeniably that's much harder to do than finishing fourth. Forest finished 3rd a few times and were runners up two but didn't get in because you had to win your league.

 

After that as Art pointed out, you could be Red Star or Ajax and have a great side and not a shit side because all of your potential good players belonged to Man City instead.

 

Is modern football better? That's subjective. It isn't my preference.

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So, Liverpool fans have started a petition for UEFA & FIFA to punish Ramos for his challenge on Salah that forced him off the pitch!!!!

 

Total waste of time comes to mind.

They'll still be fighting for justice on this in 30 years time!

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So, Liverpool fans have started a petition for UEFA & FIFA to punish Ramos for his challenge on Salah that forced him off the pitch!!!!

 

Total waste of time comes to mind.

 

Always a victim never the cause was never so apt .......... Micky Mousers are surely the most myopic of football suporters bar none ..... You lost Madrid won get over it !!!!

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There's a few teams currently that get in that can't compete but that's good...if they weren't there people like you would moan even more.

 

I picked out 4 names from the 78/79 season but could've literally picked another 10 maybe more that were just cannon fodder. If you liked watching Zbrojovka Brno vs Újpesti Dózsa back in the day then good for you but I'll take a higher-quality game like Liverpool vs City this year (2 non-domestic champions).

 

And no I didn't just make those teams up...that was a genuine first round tie in 1978. I consider myself to have a pretty wide range of football knowledge and hadn't actually heard of 10 of the first round teams in 1978 and 12 of the teams in 79/80.

 

My overall point is that because you get more teams from the top leagues the quality is higher. Therefore it is more difficult to win.

 

 

Don't talk fucking bollocks.

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Looking into it further I can see Forest played 9 games to win it. Real Madrid won it this year after playing 13 games.

 

 

Forest played 9 knockout games.Real Madrid won it this year playing just 7 knockout games.

 

I am pretty certain that it is mathematically possible that you can qualify from the group stages winning 2 and losing 4.

 

All of the unknown teams are still in the competition Savo, but they have to play two qualifying rounds before going into a third qualifying round where the likes of Liverpool, Napoli, and CSKA (this season) join the qualifiers. It is set up for the "big" clubs to progress quite easily to the last 16 and quarters.

 

For me, the competition doesn't begin until the quarter finals, but you can just about predict the last 8 from a pool of about 12 teams. It's rigged, it keeps the money among the same old teams, season in, season out, and the group stages are mind numbingly boring. I think less than 8000 turned up for Juve's last group game a couple of seasons ago.

 

Scrap the group stages, expand the competition to 64 teams, and make it an unseeded knockout competition from the first round. Oh, and make it what the name suggests.......Champions only.

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Forest played 9 knockout games.Real Madrid won it this year playing just 7 knockout games.

 

I am pretty certain that it is mathematically possible that you can qualify from the group stages winning 2 and losing 4.

 

All of the unknown teams are still in the competition Savo, but they have to play two qualifying rounds before going into a third qualifying round where the likes of Liverpool, Napoli, and CSKA (this season) join the qualifiers. It is set up for the "big" clubs to progress quite easily to the last 16 and quarters.

 

For me, the competition doesn't begin until the quarter finals, but you can just about predict the last 8 from a pool of about 12 teams. It's rigged, it keeps the money among the same old teams, season in, season out, and the group stages are mind numbingly boring. I think less than 8000 turned up for Juve's last group game a couple of seasons ago.

 

Scrap the group stages, expand the competition to 64 teams, and make it an unseeded knockout competition from the first round. Oh, and make it what the name suggests.......Champions only.

 

Agree on the whole Dane but the last part of your plan falls down a bit, there are only 50 countries in Europe.

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Forest played 9 knockout games.Real Madrid won it this year playing just 7 knockout games.

 

I am pretty certain that it is mathematically possible that you can qualify from the group stages winning 2 and losing 4.

 

All of the unknown teams are still in the competition Savo, but they have to play two qualifying rounds before going into a third qualifying round where the likes of Liverpool, Napoli, and CSKA (this season) join the qualifiers. It is set up for the "big" clubs to progress quite easily to the last 16 and quarters.

 

For me, the competition doesn't begin until the quarter finals, but you can just about predict the last 8 from a pool of about 12 teams. It's rigged, it keeps the money among the same old teams, season in, season out, and the group stages are mind numbingly boring. I think less than 8000 turned up for Juve's last group game a couple of seasons ago.

 

Scrap the group stages, expand the competition to 64 teams, and make it an unseeded knockout competition from the first round. Oh, and make it what the name suggests.......Champions only.

I don't necessarily disagree with any of that. It is a closed shop to a degree. Although saying that...since Liverpool won it in 05 the final has produced the following teams. Liverpool x3, Milan x2, Inter, Juventus x2, Chelsea x2, Man Utd x3, Arsenal, Bayern x3, Dortmund, Atletico Madrid x2, Barcelona x4, Real Madrid x4. There's a reasonable level of variety there but it just so happens it's been particularly dominated by Real in the last few seasons. But this used to happen as well, Liverpool, Real Madrid, Ajax, Bayern and Milan all had periods of complete dominance in the old days. Even we retained the trophy which under the new format had never been done until last year.

 

You could argue that it being a closed shop backs up my point that it's harder to win now. Depends who you are. If you're one of the big rich clubs I've mentioned then it is more possible but still very tough as the quality at the business end of the competition is so high. If it was easier now Man City and PSG would've won it.

 

If you're not a big rich club then it is nigh on impossible.

 

I'm just using the period of time around when we won it as an example but in the early rounds back then there were some incredible hammerings. In 79/80 Ajax scored 26 goals in their first three games :lol:. They won 8-1, 8-1 again and then 10-0. In other games there was a 6-1 (twice) a 7-0 an 8-0. Out of interest I looked at the season before as well (77/78) and Celtic beat a team called Jeunesse Esch (Luxembourg champions obviously :D) 11-1 on aggregate. Some of those early round games look like a joke and surely can't have been very watchable back then. Yes it was unseeded so you could've got Jeunesse Esch or you could've got Liverpool but with the increased televised nature of the game it's no wonder they changed it to get less champions but more quality teams in. It was a farce then if you drew one of about 6 or 7 teams in the early rounds.

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Savo, if you want keep believing it is harder to win now just carry on believing it don't let anybody prevent you...

 

In the meantime, we will all just stick to the truth.

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Savo, if you want keep believing it is harder to win now just carry on believing it don't let anybody prevent you...

 

In the meantime, we will all just stick to the truth.

Ok thanks for allowing me to have my own opinion Deano :lol: Edited by Savo

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Agree on the whole Dane but the last part of your plan falls down a bit, there are only 50 countries in Europe.

 

:D Although I think there are more than that in football terms. For example there are places like Gibralta with their own domestic leagues and National teams, places like Israel that slip into Europe when it comes to football, and places like the UK that becomes four seperate countries. then there's the holders. I think we can scrape close to 60 if we put our minds to it.

 

The rest could be made up with invites for teams of historical significance - for example, just thinking of something at random, teams who've retained the cup?......... ^_^

Edited by Art Vandelay

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Fucking unbelievabubble - I hate the scousers but that was amazing. Fair play to them 👏

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Spurs are at it now. 

Incredible set of performances. Shows the value of such a competitive league.

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Got to laugh at the Ajax fans singing "Don't worry about a thing, cause every little thing gonna be alright" when 2-0 up. Oh, really? :lol:

 

Still, I did feel rather sorry for Ajax, they looked devastated when the third went in and I thought they were the better side over the two legs. Plus I think Liverpool - Ajax would have made a better final with less of an "FA Cup" feel to it.

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