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4 hours ago, Daz555 said:

So now we wait once again for Parliament to reject this crappy deal - as they should. It's a bad deal if you are a remainer or a brexiter.

Yes, but what happens next? The United Kingdom is preverbally fuc*ed whichever way. The European Union dream is shifting towards a Federal Europe which is completely alien to the British democracy and ideology. This country already on the cusp of Europe has always felt alienated, and secluded as Germany and France have dictated policies. Only strategic vetoes or amendments have prevented this country being forced to adopt unacceptable policies that could impact heavily on our daily lives. Although Freedom of Movement, Fisheries and Agricultural (CAP) policies, Animal welfare standards, EU Grant system, state aid rules have inadvertently and fundamentally damaged this country. What else do the "remain" voters want 'us' to surrender to Europe?  

If there is a second referendum I would like the campaign to highlight many of the costs of staying in the EU as not one politician, remain or leave campaigner, nor financial expert have justifiably discussed many of the disadvantages of staying in the single market or customs union. How many EU advocates understand the true impact of staying in the Union? As the anti-Brexiteers continually use their crystal balls to predict the future if we leave the EU, how about those advocates state the consequences of actually staying or cost of further integration.     

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19 hours ago, H-Block said:

 

Well, hang on, to who would the Russians be the preferred choice? Evidently to the Kurds, who it seems will happily enter into a marriage of convenience with anyone who'll prop them up. But they'll never be the choice of the Syrian people who they've been bombing.

Part of Turkey's mission to re-settle Syrian Arabs who were driven out of their own homeland by the media darlings the Kurds. Are you seriously saying you prefer Assad (who attacks his own people) and his Russian allies over this?

 

 

No, I'm saying the US should have hung in there until it's sorted, instead of allowing their allies most feared enemy a free run on them.  Honestly, listen to any Turk talk about Kurds and they go all rabid.  Turkey don't give a fuck about Syria, they're in it for the Kurds and Trump handed them on a plate.  You know it's a massive fuck up when literally everyone sees it, even his own pals who are trying to iron it out now.

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With this Brexit thing, it's almost as if no crooked fucker thought it through for more than ten minutes, or beyond what they intended to make by promoting it, when they set this in motion.

Any implications should have been tackled before this even started.  And that's leaving aside the difficulties of getting it through Parliament, where those twats are as entrenched in their position as everyone in our society seems to be so there's sod all chance of getting anything agreed there either. 

This is what happens when you spend years peddling propaganda but haven't got the brains to deal in reality. 

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40 minutes ago, Charlie Cheswick said:

With this Brexit thing, it's almost as if no crooked fucker thought it through for more than ten minutes, or beyond what they intended to make by promoting it, when they set this in motion.

Any implications should have been tackled before this even started.  And that's leaving aside the difficulties of getting it through Parliament, where those twats are as entrenched in their position as everyone in our society seems to be so there's sod all chance of getting anything agreed there either. 

This is what happens when you spend years peddling propaganda but haven't got the brains to deal in reality. 

And so it goes on, Chaz.

Boris gets a deal agreed with the EU, and straight away the DUP say they won't back the deal. Keep your foreskin Corbyn says Labour won't back the deal, and the snowflake Lib Dems don't want any kind of deal. Saturdays vote in the Commons should be fun.

Time for some firm action from the PM. He needs to tell the House that this is the deal, there's no time to debate another deal, and the MP's vote in favour of this deal or he'll bring us out with no deal on the 31st.

Fuck 'em all. This will go on for ever unless Boris does the dirty deed on the 31st.

 

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15 hours ago, Dane B said:

Time for some firm action from the PM. He needs to tell the House that this is the deal, there's no time to debate another deal, and the MP's vote in favour of this deal or he'll bring us out with no deal on the 31st.

Since when did we live under a dictatorship? No MP is obliged to vote this deal through, especially without any time to scrutinise it. 

I’ve seen this morning Raab describe NI getting a ‘cracking deal’. If it’s that fucking good then why aren’t the rest of the UK getting it also?

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15 hours ago, Dane B said:

And so it goes on, Chaz.

Boris gets a deal agreed with the EU, and straight away the DUP say they won't back the deal. Keep your foreskin Corbyn says Labour won't back the deal, and the snowflake Lib Dems don't want any kind of deal. Saturdays vote in the Commons should be fun.

Time for some firm action from the PM. He needs to tell the House that this is the deal, there's no time to debate another deal, and the MP's vote in favour of this deal or he'll bring us out with no deal on the 31st.

Fuck 'em all. This will go on for ever unless Boris does the dirty deed on the 31st.

 

You missed off your mate Farage who said the deal wasn't Brexity enough

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16 hours ago, nemesiz said:

Yes, but what happens next? The United Kingdom is preverbally fuc*ed whichever way. The European Union dream is shifting towards a Federal Europe which is completely alien to the British democracy and ideology. This country already on the cusp of Europe has always felt alienated, and secluded as Germany and France have dictated policies. Only strategic vetoes or amendments have prevented this country being forced to adopt unacceptable policies that could impact heavily on our daily lives. Although Freedom of Movement, Fisheries and Agricultural (CAP) policies, Animal welfare standards, EU Grant system, state aid rules have inadvertently and fundamentally damaged this country. What else do the "remain" voters want 'us' to surrender to Europe?  

If there is a second referendum I would like the campaign to highlight many of the costs of staying in the EU as not one politician, remain or leave campaigner, nor financial expert have justifiably discussed many of the disadvantages of staying in the single market or customs union. How many EU advocates understand the true impact of staying in the Union? As the anti-Brexiteers continually use their crystal balls to predict the future if we leave the EU, how about those advocates state the consequences of actually staying or cost of further integration.     

Nemesiz - none of my business but what line of work are you in? You're opinions are excellent.

I am a remainer. Why? Well I have a pretty decent life and in bringing up a young family, I don't want to change things. I run an SME in the East Midlands and business has been steady, however we have already seen projects move to mainland Europe since the referendum as our large clients want to be HQ'd in the trading block not on an isolated Island.

You mention "Freedom of Movement, Fisheries and Agricultural (CAP) policies, Animal welfare standards, EU Grant system, state aid rules". I'll be honest, I've never felt these have ever directly affected me (could be my ignorance, I'm not trying to be smart). You also mentioned " a Federal Europe which is completely alien to the British democracy and ideology". Again, this doesn't really bother me....seems a but outdated to beat the proverbial "proud to be British" drum.

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8 hours ago, Ben said:

You missed off your mate Farage who said the deal wasn't Brexity enough

Mate, I just want it over and done with. I'm fed up of getting up every morning and listening to Brexit dominating the news. with self serving MP's talking bigger bollocks than Lviv.

At this moment in time Ben, I'd take Boris' deal, no deal, or ripping up article 50. In fact the only outcome I wouldn't want is another referendum. It'd just start all over again.

I ain't ever voting for any of our political parties, any MP, or any referendum ever again after this complete fuck up......unless it's a referendum on should we try all of our MP's for treason. Fuck em.

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Like Ben, I've always been in the convince me that changing things is better camp.  I look at all the drongos who have advocated leave, Rhys Mogg, Farage, Boris, Gove, Trump, etc, and I know for certain I wouldn't trust any one of them to do something that wasn't just about furthering their own interests, nor that I would trust any of them to do something worthwhile for anyone but them.  Guarantee all of the above will make a fortune out of Brexit while everyone they've hoodwinked gets it up the bum.

Then on the other side of other side of the political spectrum and we'd have Corbyn who'd want to get out on his terms and I wouldn't trust the cult of Corbyn much to have us fairing better seeing as he's hell bent on introducing policies that nobody has given a fuck about for 30 years. 

My crystal ball says it'll go badly when we leave because we're run by a bunch of shit houses.  Same as before the referendum. 

We've been sold the idea that we'll gain more control but I don't want any of this lot having any control. 

What will be will be though and I'd assume we'll leave on the 31st, Boris will be proclaimed as a hero, then with hindsight we'll look back on this as a fuck up from start to finish.  Just give it a few months for the shit to hit the fan. 

I honestly wouldn't be bothered about leaving if a single one of our leaders was capable of anything but furthering their own pockets and influence. 

In short, it turns out the best deal we can get is not leaving at all.

Edited by Charlie Cheswick
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I'd prefer to remain in the EU, but I could have lived with May's deal. It seemed to be a middle road for a divided country, giving both remainers and leavers their headline campaign promises - tariff free trade and alignment of employment rights for the remainers, control of immigration and making our own laws for the leavers.

Johnson's deal is  different prospect entirely. First of all, it doesn't actually deliver tariff free trade with the EU, just an aspiration to spend the next year negotiating towards one. In that respect, it's not really a "deal" at all. Worst case, we could still end up with no trade deal in a year's time. However, what really concerns me about the Johnson deal is the lack of commitment to align employment rights to those in the EU. Given this was in May's deal, you have to wonder why Johnson chose to remove it. A Tory government with no EU directing its employment laws and no legal commitment to mirror EU employment laws could cause misery for many working people. We'll gradually become a low rights, low pay, work until you drop economy. That probably appeals if you're the employer, if like me, you're the employee, that could see a significant reduction in the quality of your life and your wellbeing. For these reasons I hope Johnson's deal fails today.

Edited by H-Block
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On 10/18/2019 at 5:20 PM, Dane B said:

Mate, I just want it over and done with. I'm fed up of getting up every morning and listening to Brexit dominating the news. with self serving MP's talking bigger bollocks than Lviv.

At this moment in time Ben, I'd take Boris' deal, no deal, or ripping up article 50. In fact the only outcome I wouldn't want is another referendum. It'd just start all over again.

I ain't ever voting for any of our political parties, any MP, or any referendum ever again after this complete fuck up......unless it's a referendum on should we try all of our MP's for treason. Fuck em.

Look at this cunt he dont know what Boris's deal is but he will take it . He did not know whatt Brexit entailed but he voted for it .  Tell me now , What are you going to get from coming out the EU that you aint getting now .  What is it about your life that will change for the better being out .?.  I know the answer but I want to hear the fucker from a brexiter,

 

 

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10 hours ago, H-Block said:

I'd prefer to remain in the EU, but I could have lived with May's deal. It seemed to be a middle road for a divided country, giving both remainers and leavers their headline campaign promises - tariff free trade and alignment of employment rights for the remainers, control of immigration and making our own laws for the leavers.

Johnson's deal is  different prospect entirely. First of all, it doesn't actually deliver tariff free trade with the EU, just an aspiration to spend the next year negotiating towards one. In that respect, it's not really a "deal" at all. Worst case, we could still end up with no trade deal in a year's time. However, what really concerns me about the Johnson deal is the lack of commitment to align employment rights to those in the EU. Given this was in May's deal, you have to wonder why Johnson chose to remove it. A Tory government with no EU directing its employment laws and no legal commitment to mirror EU employment laws could cause misery for many working people. We'll gradually become a low rights, low pay, work until you drop economy. That probably appeals if you're the employer, if like me, you're the employee, that could see a significant reduction in the quality of your life and your wellbeing. For these reasons I hope Johnson's deal fails today.

Wheres the UKIP leader on here IKS?, You would think he would have the decency to say,  lviv old lad yer were right but no . hes harder to find on here than fucking Lord Lucan.

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2 hours ago, Lvivska said:

 He did not know whatt Brexit entailed but he voted for it . 

 

Wrong as usual Andy. I reckon the last time you got something right was 1976 when you said we'd have a nice Summer.

I didn't vote, you old hag.

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On 10/18/2019 at 5:20 PM, Dane B said:

Mate, I just want it over and done with. I'm fed up of getting up every morning and listening to Brexit dominating the news. with self serving MP's talking bigger bollocks than Lviv.

At this moment in time Ben, I'd take Boris' deal, no deal, or ripping up article 50. In fact the only outcome I wouldn't want is another referendum. It'd just start all over again.

I ain't ever voting for any of our political parties, any MP, or any referendum ever again after this complete fuck up......unless it's a referendum on should we try all of our MP's for treason. Fuck em.

Johnson's deal gets nothing over with. Nothing. It is just the start of 10 years of cliff edge decisions related to our relationship with the EU starting with the need to secure a trade deal with them in less than a year.

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45 minutes ago, Daz555 said:

Johnson's deal gets nothing over with. Nothing. It is just the start of 10 years of cliff edge decisions related to our relationship with the EU starting with the need to secure a trade deal with them in less than a year.

Read my post again Daz. I just want it over with. BJ's deal, no deal, or just rip up article 50. Just get it done. It is now beyond farcical.

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13 hours ago, Lvivska said:

Wheres the UKIP leader on here IKS?, You would think he would have the decency to say,  lviv old lad yer were right but no . hes harder to find on here than fucking Lord Lucan.

What's the fucking point of commenting on here? They could sit you on a throne with  £50 million quid and blow jobs on demand from a bevy of buxom babes and if you could be persuaded to vote leave.. but you and all you other stuck in the mud cunts would still sulk and stamp yer feet.

There's been a lot of talk about the age demographic of people who weren't old enough to be aware of the implications of leaving the eu and would now change their minds and vote remain.. Or weren't old enough to vote and would have voted to remain if they could. Well what about the young people who voted to join the common market in 1973 and are now old enough to realise what an absolute bunch of high cost fuck nuggets those remain pro eu mp's are!? Think that fucker through!

Edited by i.k.s
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For me, you don't change something because you don't like what you've got, you change something because you have a better alternative ready to go. 

This is like how Forest go through managers (the last one excepted), instead of lining up a better manager we get mad with the one we've got and throw them out.  Then we fly by the seat of our pants for a couple of months before panicking and then appointing a worse one. 

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11 hours ago, Dane B said:

Wrong as usual Andy. I reckon the last time you got something right was 1976 when you said we'd have a nice Summer.

I didn't vote, you old hag.

Then stop moaning then yer bald headed cunt

 

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41 minutes ago, i.k.s said:

What's the fucking point of commenting on here? They could sit you on a throne with  £50 million quid and blow jobs on demand from a bevy of buxom babes and if you could be persuaded to vote leave.. but you and all you other stuck in the mud cunts would still sulk and stamp yer feet.

There's been a lot of talk about the age demographic of people who weren't old enough to be aware of the implications of leaving the eu and would now change their minds and vote remain.. Or weren't old enough to vote and would have voted to remain if they could. Well what about the young people who voted to join the common market in 1973 and are now old enough to realise what an absolute bunch of high cost fuck nuggets those remain pro eu mp's are!? Think that fucker through!

You have a great life want for fuck all most of it under EU . but now you want to change it. to what, you dont fucking know , And you call me a cunt . You aint ever been the same since your Hero Farage shit on you .  I told yer he was a cunt but no IKS thinks he kows better . Now UKIP as got the coppers in again and will be looking for another leader. Put yer sen up for it youth , yer about the only cunt left that aint been leader.   

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24 minutes ago, Charlie Cheswick said:

For me, you don't change something because you don't like what you've got, you change something because you have a better alternative ready to go. 

 

Still the voice of talking sense on here I see .  Just said a similar thing to IKS . Lots of lads I know own businesses self employed etc living great lives . All you get out of em is BREXIT MEANS BREXIT etc . Ask them what they hope to get to make their life better by coming out they cannot tell you. fucking deluded . I know what Farage is going to get but he cannot tell me what I am going tto get . Why does someone with a great life what to chuck a spanner into the economic works is beyond me. 

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3 hours ago, Lvivska said:

All you get out of em is BREXIT MEANS BREXIT etc . 

I hate that statement, it is used primarily by morons with a room temperature IQ who are using a tautology as if it is somehow profound and informative when it isn't. If that is the case, presumably every one of those knuckle draggers will be content with the Norway model, as we would have achieved the referendum objective of leaving the European Union. Often this will elicit a response about they voted because of immigration and ending free movement, however, informing them nothing in the question was about the free movement of people only whether to leave the EU and this is merely their interpretation of the question, leaves them scratching their overly perplexed thick skulls. Brexit presents a range options all of which have been hijacked by the fuckwit politicians to further their own narrow agenda at the expense of the national interest. Sadly, too many people are too fucking stupid to understand this and just want their beloved Brexit irrespective of costs or consequences. 

Edited by Mr Smith
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4 hours ago, Mr Smith said:

I hate that statement, it is used primarily by morons with a room temperature IQ who are using a tautology as if it is somehow profound and informative when it isn't. If that is the case, presumably every one of those knuckle draggers will be content with the Norway model, as we would have achieved the referendum objective of leaving the European Union. Often this will elicit a response about they voted because of immigration and ending free movement, however, informing them nothing in the question was about the free movement of people only whether to leave the EU and this is merely their interpretation of the question, leaves them scratching their overly perplexed thick skulls. Brexit presents a range options all of which have been hijacked by the fuckwit politicians to further their own narrow agenda at the expense of the national interest. Sadly, too many people are too fucking stupid to understand this and just want their beloved Brexit irrespective of costs or consequences. 

Spot on. Farage is a particular proponent of this phrase yet strangely enough he and many prominent figures in the Brexit sphere were quite happy with a Norway before the referendum yet now seem to have jumped on the its not Brexit enough.

Norway has had a bad press as “Fax democracy” and “ all pay and no say”, based on something Cameron initially came out with despite being wrong. He stole the notion from  Norwegian politicians who were trying to create a cause in order to persuade Norway to become full members.

I know I’m a stuck record but EFTA / EEA is the best option for us. Being in the EU is not a vote for the status quo and it’s on a journal to full federalism. Being out does bring advantages.

One of those is that most EU rules are set at a level above the EU (ISO, UNECE and WTO). Out of the EU, we get an individual seat  in our own right and not have 1/28th of a vote as we currently have as EU members.

As to a plan, there was a perfectly good one in this.

 

http://www.eureferendum.com/documents/flexcit.pdf
 

Edited by leather
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If you have a couple of minutes spare listen to this interview with Lord Mervyn King, ex Bank of England Chairman. It surmises exactly the sentiments of the majority of the users on this forum.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/news/ex-bank-of-england-boss-uk-is-neglecting-deep-problems-with-economy/ar-AAJ3DCQ?ocid=spartandhp

 

Edited by nemesiz
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I am not a particular supporter of Boris or his version of Brexit, however, it is clear that Parliament needs to either accept his deal, reject his deal and accept no deal, or come up with another deal. Whoever voted to leave the EU to increase UK Sovereignty needs their head examining.

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