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3 hours ago, Dane B said:

I've given up on the lot of 'em. 

To me it's simple. The people voted to leave, so let's leave. None of this bullshit from MP's saying I want another referendum because I know we'd be better off in the EU. It's not what you want, or think, that matters. It's the vote of the people that counts. Yet they can't seem to fathom it.

Too much scaremongering. No one knows what will happen to our economy when we leave. Perfect example of this, before the referendum the then Chancellor, George Osborn, said that a vote to leave would would be disasterous for the pound and GDP, 800,000 jobs would be lost, blah blah blah. None of that happened. They just don't fucking know, but would have us believe that they do.

Fuck the lot of them. Where's Guy Fawkes when you need him? Burn the fucking lot.

The problem is, it was never as simple as simply leaving, because we have 40-years of integrating with Europe in various ways. Norway is not in the EU, but is part of the customs union and single market. However, Leave has been interpreted to mean leaving the customs union and single market, when this question was never asked. 

Both sides lied in the referendum to suit their own agendas.

Your last point is spot on.

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8 hours ago, nottmred said:

What changed? 😭😭

Clutching at straws aren't we? Firstly I said, ages ago, he stood by what he said so I can't argue. I never said he's a "Good man". Then he had a complete about turn on everything he said about Europe. Still ..he's still firm on his other views so people are aware.

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3 hours ago, Danny said:

So if none of us know what will happen and all sensible predictions are that at the very least it’ll cause a temporary shortage of certain medical supplies, higher food costs, potentially food delays etc what is the sensible argument to leave?

No-one on the leave side of the argument ever mooted a ‘no deal’ so all this ‘leave means leave’ is bollocks. It was sold on the idea that we’d get a great deal and now we’re being asked to accept no deal whatsoever. 

Ideologically I’m not averse to leaving but still goodness knows how many years on no-one has put forward a positive, realistic argument as to why this would be a good move. 

 

I'm at this point too.  I was never particularly attached to the EU, but if you're going to come out you've got to not fuck it up.  It isn't good enough to say we we want out country back and all that, if you 'want your country' back stop being such a bunch of clueless, corrupt lame brains, come up with a proper plan or fuck right off.  

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13 hours ago, Charlie Cheswick said:

Danny said...

So if none of us know what will happen and all sensible predictions are that at the very least it’ll cause a temporary shortage of certain medical supplies, higher food costs, potentially food delays etc what is the sensible argument to leave?

Well first off lets answer the question of shortage of food and drugs. The supermarkets for the last few years have reduced their suppliers of particular fresh fruit, dairy and vegetable to cut costs, which has had a knock-on effect and massive disruption to the Farmers and the chain-supply. Many have gone out of business losing key contracts. As a consequence there is no leeway or slack within the supply chain especially the domestic market. Another factor is a shortage of key staff and personnel. Morrisons supermarket chain lost drivers and warehouse staff when an Aldi distribution centre opened a mile away from their depot. This is not just Brexit, but rather an issue with lack of training, and a dependence on cheap labour.

Concerning medical supplies if you've heard the news lately there is a massive overhaul with the regulatory and manufacturing process of drugs and equipment which is causing massive disruption to the distribution and production of key products. Furthermore a large number of Patents for drugs, creams and other suppliers have rescinded or relapsed thus many Drug multi-national companies have stopped producing the items, and rivals have started to release generic versions of those drugs. The other major factor is that multi-national companies are buying up rivals, shutting down excess production or alternative supplies, or worse charging extortionate amount of money for common drugs!. This is not just Brexit, but rather economy of scale and pure capitalism at it's worst!

Of course there will be delays and effect on distribution, especially if the EU want to fully implement rules and regulations regarding border security, controls and checking goods at Ports but if the short-term delays are too harsh political pressure will be put on the national governments by key industries and militant unions (i.e French and Spanish Farmers).  

Sensible argument to leave? We've discussed this previously in detail unfortunately I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that the bureaucrats, industry leaders and political elite are too inept, incompetent, selfish, lack vision, intelligence, wisdom and essential common sense to show the management, leadership, and critical decision making to actually take this country forward.

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16 hours ago, Charlie Cheswick said:

 

I'm at this point too.  I was never particularly attached to the EU, but if you're going to come out you've got to not fuck it up.  It isn't good enough to say we we want out country back and all that, if you 'want your country' back stop being such a bunch of clueless, corrupt lame brains, come up with a proper plan or fuck right off.  

I am starting to waiver actually and think about changing to Remain. Tbh I am at the point of thinking life was easy enough being part of the EU so why give a shit about leaving and I do not trust the likes of BJ to do any decent deals should we leave (or any of the cunts come to that). All this we want our country back - it is too little too late the horse has bolted. All you have to do is pick up a copy of the Evening Standard and we are already at well over 100 murders this year and it is 90% black and Asian teenage gangs. So better to Remain and spend the money on a better Police force imo 

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3 hours ago, E R said:

I am starting to waiver actually and think about changing to Remain. Tbh I am at the point of thinking life was easy enough being part of the EU so why give a shit about leaving and I do not trust the likes of BJ to do any decent deals should we leave (or any of the cunts come to that). All this we want our country back - it is too little too late the horse has bolted. All you have to do is pick up a copy of the Evening Standard and we are already at well over 100 murders this year and it is 90% black and Asian teenage gangs. So better to Remain and spend the money on a better Police force imo 

Fair play for potentially changing your mind. I'm a remainer BUT I don't live in an area infested with immigrants, so I completely understand why people would want to do something to eradicate people coming here and not working or involved in crime.I do worry about my kids becoming a minority vs Muslims.

Your point on Asian teenage gangs......does this have any bearing on EU membership? Surely this relates to immigration from outside of the EU?

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30 minutes ago, Ben said:

I do worry about my kids becoming a minority vs Muslims.

Muslims make up about 5% of the population. I don’t think you’ve much to worry about. 

Edited by Danny

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2 hours ago, Danny said:

Muslims make up about 5% of the population. I don’t think you’ve much to worry about. 

Yeah probably not where I live to be honest. I don't doubt there are any concentrated areas across the UK.

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3 hours ago, Ben said:

Fair play for potentially changing your mind. I'm a remainer BUT I don't live in an area infested with immigrants, so I completely understand why people would want to do something to eradicate people coming here and not working or involved in crime.I do worry about my kids becoming a minority vs Muslims.

Your point on Asian teenage gangs......does this have any bearing on EU membership? Surely this relates to immigration from outside of the EU?

Definitely No, albeit there is a MAJOR caveat or consequence from being in the Schengen Area. Whilst UK & Ireland didn't sign up to the scheme, keeping our own border controls, freedom of movement has allowed EU, Baltic and Russian citizens access to this country without any sufficient background or criminal record checks. Many are ineligible, but still arrive in coaches using a falsified EU Passport or documents. Unfortunately this has led to the rise in Sex and Drug Trafficking by Albanian gangs in the South-East and Home Nations. 
 

6 hours ago, E R said:

I am starting to waiver actually and think about changing to Remain. Tbh I am at the point of thinking life was easy enough being part of the EU so why give a shit about leaving and I do not trust the likes of BJ to do any decent deals should we leave (or any of the cunts come to that). All this we want our country back - it is too little too late the horse has bolted. All you have to do is pick up a copy of the Evening Standard and we are already at well over 100 murders this year and it is 90% black and Asian teenage gangs. So better to Remain and spend the money on a better Police force imo 

Unfortunately agree with your sentiments. In just over ten years the Town I live has gone from a population comprising of 99% Caucasian Native British to now nearly 30% Ethnic and EU Citizens. Whilst I'm not against diversity especially growing up with RAF College children, and working in multi-national corporations, at times it doesn't feel like my country anymore. When walking through town not hearing one person speak English, instead Russian, Polish, Bulgarian, Ugandan, Urdu, Chinese, and/or Nepalese spoken is disconcerting at best. Yes there is satisfactory integration, but diversity and larger non-native communities is causing a serious divide. Also as stated in a previous post pointed out the consequence of Polish and Eastern European citizens with a rise in Murders, Manslaughter, Drug Trafficking, Burglaries in the area! Unfortunately it's too little too late, leaving the EU will not change a thing. 

Edited by nemesiz
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7 hours ago, E R said:

I am starting to waiver actually and think about changing to Remain. Tbh I am at the point of thinking life was easy enough being part of the EU so why give a shit about leaving and I do not trust the likes of BJ to do any decent deals should we leave (or any of the cunts come to that). All this we want our country back - it is too little too late the horse has bolted. All you have to do is pick up a copy of the Evening Standard and we are already at well over 100 murders this year and it is 90% black and Asian teenage gangs. So better to Remain and spend the money on a better Police force imo 

I'd go step further and invest in lots in schools that are for kids who are a bit rough round the edges, cut the problems out at a young age and everyone's a winner.  Costs more in the short term but much less over a lifetime.

Edited by Charlie Cheswick

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5 hours ago, Ben said:

Fair play for potentially changing your mind. I'm a remainer BUT I don't live in an area infested with immigrants, so I completely understand why people would want to do something to eradicate people coming here and not working or involved in crime.I do worry about my kids becoming a minority vs Muslims.

Your point on Asian teenage gangs......does this have any bearing on EU membership? Surely this relates to immigration from outside of the EU?

Sorry what I meant by the gangs comment is that there is a fear of Romanian, Albanian etc gangs coming to Britain and I was trying to convey that it doesn’t really matter as we have plenty of Asian and African gangs already pretty much controlling London, parts of the Midlands and parts of Yorkshire and also gangs from those Eastern European countries are already here and well established. I just cannot see any difference in the way the country is heading if we did leave the EU and all these we want our country back types are just deluded as it is too late. I have a 9 year old son and it scares the shit out of me that when he is 18 he might want to go to concerts in London or out clubbing and one silly row could end up getting him killed. For me now more focus should just be on accepting the right people from Europe, exporting illegals and dealing with the gang crime in the UK. 

Edited by E R
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10 hours ago, nemesiz said:

unfortunately I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that the bureaucrats, industry leaders and political elite are too inept, incompetent, selfish, lack vision, intelligence, wisdom and essential common sense to show the management, leadership, and critical decision making to actually take this country forward.

This

All involved have failed miserably 😡

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This ineptitude has been going on for years, regardless of who's run the show. Housing has got gradually worse since the 70s, copper numbers have been cut to the point of them barely bothering anymore, if you work in the public sector good look paying your way, education is nearly back to the 80s, higher education is just gifting money to Universities through loans that'll never get paid back, little has been done to integrate communities if they haven't just done it themselves - compounded by faith schools and so on. At this stage you'd have to be deranged to think our lot could get anything right. If you're corrupt everything goes the same way and our politicians have been bent for decades.

Brexit is just a continuation of policies imvented to line a few pockets. Although staying in won't change anything, it will be one less thing that fuck us.

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Fuck me - has Boris Johnson united this outspoken forum into a view that Parliament is completely useless and has fucked up Brexit... I don't think even Megson managed to achieve such unanimity.

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I changed jobs 6 months ago and now work in Southampton city centre.  I walk down the main road of this industrial estate every day and i do not hear one single word of English. Theyre all friendly enough....but they could be friendly enough back in their own countries. There's been a black and Asian community in Southampton for 60 years now...but their areas have been swamped with eastern Europeans happy to take the minimum wage and send it home to build Gdansk's version of scarfaces mansion. Every Englishman around is pig fucking sick of it. This is European policy. Labours policy. Blairs policy. I'm still for out and I'll never waiver.

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3 hours ago, i.k.s said:

I changed jobs 6 months ago and now work in Southampton city centre.  I walk down the main road of this industrial estate every day and i do not hear one single word of English. Theyre all friendly enough....but they could be friendly enough back in their own countries. There's been a black and Asian community in Southampton for 60 years now...but their areas have been swamped with eastern Europeans happy to take the minimum wage and send it home to build Gdansk's version of scarfaces mansion. Every Englishman around is pig fucking sick of it. This is European policy. Labours policy. Blairs policy. I'm still for out and I'll never waiver.

I can't disagree with you. It's your environment and experiences that shape your attitudes. If I lived there, I'd probably vote differently.

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I don't live there mate...and C.C yeah they are busy working...7 days a week. Well I say working. They turn up and do the bare fucking minimum.

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I am not quite sure why the big celebration that the meddling courts have decided BJ unlawfully prorogued parliament? They have been at it for 3 years on Brexit and blocked any deal that was negotiated so what do they expect to achieve in the next 3 weeks?

Labour themselves don’t know whether they are backing Remain or a second referendum and are terrified of another election plus a no deal Brexit has been blocked I believe - so quite what they are hoping to achieve in the next 3 or 4 weeks will certainly be interesting but my guess will be fuck all 

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4 hours ago, E R said:

I am not quite sure why the big celebration that the meddling courts have decided BJ unlawfully prorogued parliament? They have been at it for 3 years on Brexit and blocked any deal that was negotiated so what do they expect to achieve in the next 3 weeks?

Labour themselves don’t know whether they are backing Remain or a second referendum and are terrified of another election plus a no deal Brexit has been blocked I believe - so quite what they are hoping to achieve in the next 3 or 4 weeks will certainly be interesting but my guess will be fuck all 

I think the remainers, or should I say, those that have fucked up any chance we have of leaving on 31st October, are wanting the EU to grant us an extension past the 31st, and are hoping the extension, imposed by the EU, will be years, not months.

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1 hour ago, Dane B said:

I think the remainers, or should I say, those that have fucked up any chance we have of leaving on 31st October, are wanting the EU to grant us an extension past the 31st, and are hoping the extension, imposed by the EU, will be years, not months.

It was parliament inc Boris Et al that decided the deal wasn't good enough.

Out of interest Dane, what trade deals do we have in place for 1st Nov?

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42 minutes ago, Ben said:

It was parliament inc Boris Et al that decided the deal wasn't good enough.

Out of interest Dane, what trade deals do we have in place for 1st Nov?

What trade deals do the rest of the EU have in place for when we leave? Can they afford, and lets face it there's some piss poor countries in the EU, to just stop trading with us? Will the German and French car manufacturers turn their backs on what is a huge market for them? I doubt it.

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4 hours ago, Dane B said:

What trade deals do the rest of the EU have in place for when we leave? Can they afford, and lets face it there's some piss poor countries in the EU, to just stop trading with us? Will the German and French car manufacturers turn their backs on what is a huge market for them? I doubt it.

In other words us coming out now having still not sorted anything would fuck all of us. 

I couldn't care less about remaining or leaving in principle but I don't want to be poorer. Those of you who are desperate to have less can send me their cash. Everyone's a winner.

 

Edited by Charlie Cheswick

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3 hours ago, Ben said:

It was parliament inc Boris Et al that decided the deal wasn't good enough.

Out of interest Dane, what trade deals do we have in place for 1st Nov?

 https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-trade-agreements-with-non-eu-countries-in-a-no-deal-brexit

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