Jump to content
visa52

hillsborough

Recommended Posts

whay are the scousers still going on about hillsborough

 

 

you dont hear bradford going on about what happened there and you dont hear juventus keep going on about what liverpool did to them

 

it was terrible what happened but ffs let it go

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bradford and Ibrox before it were tragedies indeed, and whilst building and other regulations were a factor there, Hillsborough was on a different scale, where a catalogue of errors were made by the police and others providing emergency services for the game - not to mention serious questions of cover ups, missing CCTV etc etc, none of which happened in the previous 2 (I think). I was there. It was horrendous, even as a Forest fan. If I was a Scouser, I'm not sure I would just shrug my shoulders and get on with it.

 

If you haven't read it - look at the official Taylor report into Hillsborough - and then you will see why people remain angry and want questions answered that haven't been !

Edited by Tomo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought it was all sorted . The Coppers got the blame and the Scousers did nothing wrong . The ctv cameras will show the scousers queuing up outside the Leppings lane end in an orderly fashion .

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You would have thought the one set of fans who wouldn't want everything to come out would be the scousers.

 

Sorry

In perhaps a moment of unfortunate timing, Kelvin MacKenzie's column appeared in The Daily Mail on Monday, and do you know, he had an apology to make!

 

Surely this would be the ideal time for MacKenzie to apologise for The Sun's infamous Hillsborough story, published when he was the paper's editor.

 

Ha! No chance. He instead apologises for being a bit rude to Lord Leveson during his speech to the phone-hacking hearing.

 

To clarify...being a bit rude to a Lord: Sorry.

 

Saying Liverpool fans urinated on and picked the pockets of the dead: "I was not sorry then and I'm not sorry now." (K. MacKenzie, December 2006).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought it was all sorted . The Coppers got the blame and the Scousers did nothing wrong . The ctv cameras will show the scousers queuing up outside the Leppings lane end in an orderly fashion .

 

same at hysel.....uefa`s fault for choosing a ground where fences were easily ripped down to get at juve fans and having a wall not strong enough to withstand people getting crushed.............definatly not the fault of liverpool fans,

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

same at hysel.....uefa`s fault for choosing a ground where fences were easily ripped down to get at juve fans and having a wall not strong enough to withstand people getting crushed.............definatly not the fault of liverpool fans,

 

As above - read the official report my friend rather than The Sun headlines, and you may feel differently.

Edited by Tomo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was there as well Tomo my lad was with me . He's 34 now and still uneasy in a crowd it was truly horrific. Fair play to the familys of the dead they want to see all the papers on the disaster and that is only right and proper . What did the report say about the fan who ran on the pitch when the game had stopped and ran to our end and started goading us ?.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was there as well Tomo my lad was with me . He's 34 now and still uneasy in a crowd it was truly horrific. Fair play to the familys of the dead they want to see all the papers on the disaster and that is only right and proper . What did the report say about the fan who ran on the pitch when the game had stopped and ran to our end and started goading us ?.

 

No idea... hardly the principal issue that the report would concern itself with though is it ?.

 

I remember the L'pool fans coming over too - many going ballistic. I spoke with a couple of them in the pubs several hours later. They were angry that Forest fans were taking the piss and singing the usual anti-Scouse songs. No doubt like you, most of us thought the disturbance at the Leppings Lane end were the Scousers trying to invade the pitch, and it was only many minutes later that the singing and jeering stopped and that deadly silence began when we realised what was going on. We didn't know what was going on, but they didn't know that we couldn't really see what was going on and weren't happy....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tomo, answer me this.

 

Would it have happened had hundreds/thousands of pissed up scousers not tried to ram in and charge the gates? Had they queued in orderly fashion like 99.99% of the population, would it still have happened?

 

I was there, only 9 at the time (it was the catalyst for the bloke who used to take me after my old man died to stop, he didnt want the responsibility) and i know what i saw from certain Liverpool fans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tomo, answer me this.

 

Would it have happened had hundreds/thousands of pissed up scousers not tried to ram in and charge the gates? Had they queued in orderly fashion like 99.99% of the population, would it still have happened?

 

I was there, only 9 at the time (it was the catalyst for the bloke who used to take me after my old man died to stop, he didnt want the responsibility) and i know what i saw from certain Liverpool fans.

 

I take your point - but I'm guessing from your age that you didn't experience getting in and out of the old Trent end when it was a terrace - It was very rarely orderly, and nor was it at many of the grounds I went to. The previous year at Hillsborough when we played them at the same SF stage, the police had a line of officers at the Leppings Lane end, supervising fans into the turnstiles to prevent a crush. That was not there in 1989 for some reason. The decision to open the gates was, in hindsight, a catastrophic one.

 

In all reality the vast majority of Forest fans would have been just as desperate to get in to see a semi final too, knowing the game had started. As for loads of pissed scousers...again I suggest read the official report rather than recirculating rumours. As far as I remember, almost none of those who died had significant levels of alcohol in their systems, and several of those were late arrivals. Unquestionably some were drunk (as were some Forest fans), but to suggest all L'pool fans were pissed up is just not true.

Edited by Tomo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Liverpool fans want 'justice' but to this day I have no idea what is meant by this and it is their wallowing in this cult like grief that is so pathetic - more people died of SARS and nobody gives a fuck about that anymore. With the state of football stadiums, Hillsborough was a tragedy waiting to happen, but it was over twenty-years ago and the intense Scouse campaign seems like a case of they "doth protest too much".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Liverpool fans want 'justice' but to this day I have no idea what is meant by this and it is their wallowing in this cult like grief that is so pathetic - more people died of SARS and nobody gives a fuck about that anymore. With the state of football stadiums, Hillsborough was a tragedy waiting to happen, but it was over twenty-years ago and the intense Scouse campaign seems like a case of they "doth protest too much".

 

I think they want justice, because so far no-one has been bought to account for what happened (unlike the Bradford disaster for example), and are not best pleased with 22 years of silence from many involved, conflicting evidence etc. I may be wrong, but would guess that if the 96 who died were Forest fans, and amongst them were members of your family and friends, then you may feel differently.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I think they want justice, because so far no-one has been bought to account for what happened (unlike the Bradford disaster for example), and are not best pleased with 22 years of silence from many involved, conflicting evidence etc. I may be wrong, but would guess that if the 96 who died were Forest fans, and amongst them were members of your family and friends, then you may feel differently.....

 

 

has anyone been bought to account for hysel? i donk know.....if so what was the verdict?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tomo, answer me this.

 

Would it have happened had hundreds/thousands of pissed up scousers not tried to ram in and charge the gates? Had they queued in orderly fashion like 99.99% of the population, would it still have happened?

 

I was there, only 9 at the time (it was the catalyst for the bloke who used to take me after my old man died to stop, he didnt want the responsibility) and i know what i saw from certain Liverpool fans.

Similarly I was 12 and saw enough ticketless Scousers and enough of them in no rush whatsoever to get to the ground.

 

Those that caused it are still alive today and the poor sods that got in the Leppings Lane End an hour and a half before kick off to get a good spot on the terrace were killed, like animals by animals.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Similarly I was 12 and saw enough ticketless Scousers and enough of them in no rush whatsoever to get to the ground.

 

Those that caused it are still alive today and the poor sods that got in the Leppings Lane End an hour and a half before kick off to get a good spot on the terrace were killed, like animals by animals.

 

Well folks, sorry to be repetetive, but you can choose to believe years of gossip, tabloid headlines and stories that you would like to be true, or you can read the official enquiry and report, that interviewed hundreds of witnesses, saw thousands of pages of official testimony, had access to post mortems, ground design, ticket allocation and those looking for tickets, amount of alcohol drunk, CCTV etc., etc.,

Edited by Tomo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because official reports are completely infallible. I salute your faith in our elected officials and the minons they appoint to do their leg work, especially at the time with an electon that was no means certain looming.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because official reports are completely infallible. I salute your faith in our elected officials and the minons they appoint to do their leg work, especially at the time with an electon that was no means certain looming.

 

I am not suggesting they are infallible at all - but do you really think rumour, gossip, idle journalism etc are more reliable then ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ground design and any other mitigating factors would not have even been had their 'supporters' done the right thing pre match.

 

And to tell people that went to the game they are listening to gossip and tabloid headlines is bullshit and exactly the sort of blinkered attitude that 99% of Scousers share also.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I take your point - but I'm guessing from your age that you didn't experience getting in and out of the old Trent end when it was a terrace - It was very rarely orderly, and nor was it at many of the grounds I went to. The previous year at Hillsborough when we played them at the same SF stage, the police had a line of officers at the Leppings Lane end, supervising fans into the turnstiles to prevent a crush. That was not there in 1989 for some reason. The decision to open the gates was, in hindsight, a catastrophic one.

 

I remember the old Trent End Tomo. Safe as fuck till they put 7ft metal fences in it to section off the terrace. Everyone wanted to be in the middle section behind the goal. The police used to try and control the amount of fans entering that section, but how many times did you see fans climbing the fence from one section into the middle section? It happened all the time. Whoever instructed the erection of fences at football grounds should have been held responsible for what happened at Hillsborough. Without those fences fans could have dispersed left and right to avoid the crush. In fact, without those fences there wouldn't have been a crush.

 

In all reality the vast majority of Forest fans would have been just as desperate to get in to see a semi final too, knowing the game had started. As for loads of pissed scousers...again I suggest read the official report rather than recirculating rumours. As far as I remember, almost none of those who died had significant levels of alcohol in their systems, and several of those were late arrivals. Unquestionably some were drunk (as were some Forest fans), but to suggest all L'pool fans were pissed up is just not true.

 

Most of those killed that day would not have had excess alcohol in their systems because they were innocent fans who had turned up in good time and with a ticket. Those poor fuckers were crushed to death by fans who had arrived late for the game, most of them pissed, and hundreds without tickets. They were the lucky ones Tomo. They were the ones doing the crushing and not the ones being crushed. Didn't liverpool fans do exactly the same thing a couple of years ago at a Champions league final. Turn up late, pissed and ticketless, and forced their way in. Will they never learn?

 

The decision to open the gates was, in hindsight, a catastrophic one.

.

 

Why were the gates opened though mate? Must have been a reason for the police to have to make a decision to open those gates. Was it to prevent a crush outside the ground because thousands of fans were out there trying to force their way in? Did the Taylor report say that all those fans were sober and all had tickets?

 

I haven't read the Taylor report. I honestly believe that it was a massive cover up. Blame any fucker, bar the Liverpool fans. Can't upset their feelings can we? The police are an easy target, we'll lay most of the blame at their feet. Fact is, the police were forced to open those gates to stop Scousers killing each other outside the ground. All it led too was Scousers killing each other inside the ground.

 

Nothing will convince me that this disaster was 90% the fault of drunk ticketless fans trying to force their way in. Had the terrace not been sectioned off with fences the disaster would have been averted. But let us not forget one thing here. Hillsborough held semi final matches nearly every other season without any deaths. What was the catalyst for disaster on this particular day? I can only point to the actions of a few thousand Scousers on that particular day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I remember the old Trent End Tomo. Safe as fuck till they put 7ft metal fences in it to section off the terrace. Everyone wanted to be in the middle section behind the goal. The police used to try and control the amount of fans entering that section, but how many times did you see fans climbing the fence from one section into the middle section? It happened all the time. Whoever instructed the erection of fences at football grounds should have been held responsible for what happened at Hillsborough. Without those fences fans could have dispersed left and right to avoid the crush. In fact, without those fences there wouldn't have been a crush.

 

 

Most of those killed that day would not have had excess alcohol in their systems because they were innocent fans who had turned up in good time and with a ticket. Those poor fuckers were crushed to death by fans who had arrived late for the game, most of them pissed, and hundreds without tickets. They were the lucky ones Tomo. They were the ones doing the crushing and not the ones being crushed. Didn't liverpool fans do exactly the same thing a couple of years ago at a Champions league final. Turn up late, pissed and ticketless, and forced their way in. Will they never learn?

 

 

 

Why were the gates opened though mate? Must have been a reason for the police to have to make a decision to open those gates. Was it to prevent a crush outside the ground because thousands of fans were out there trying to force their way in? Did the Taylor report say that all those fans were sober and all had tickets?

 

I haven't read the Taylor report. I honestly believe that it was a massive cover up. Blame any fucker, bar the Liverpool fans. Can't upset their feelings can we? The police are an easy target, we'll lay most of the blame at their feet. Fact is, the police were forced to open those gates to stop Scousers killing each other outside the ground. All it led too was Scousers killing each other inside the ground.

 

Nothing will convince me that this disaster was 90% the fault of drunk ticketless fans trying to force their way in. Had the terrace not been sectioned off with fences the disaster would have been averted. But let us not forget one thing here. Hillsborough held semi final matches nearly every other season without any deaths. What was the catalyst for disaster on this particular day? I can only point to the actions of a few thousand Scousers on that particular day.

 

 

Amen to that my friend . The Mickey's will never admit to culpability for their part in both the Hillsborough and Heysel disasters .. Curious don't you think that both atrocities involved them and yet.............................................

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Well folks, sorry to be repetetive, but you can choose to believe years of gossip, tabloid headlines and stories that you would like to be true, or you can read the official enquiry and report, that interviewed hundreds of witnesses, saw thousands of pages of official testimony, had access to post mortems, ground design, ticket allocation and those looking for tickets, amount of alcohol drunk, CCTV etc., etc.,

 

That official enquiry report was it written by the same folk who wrote the report on Saddams W.M.D. .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I recall the old Trent end as well Dane never hada problem . as you say My heart goes out to those poor fuckers who lost family in the disaster. . Strange that up till that day I don't recall a problem . But as you say the ones who ordered fences to be put up are the ones that should be in the dock. I aint to impressed with seats either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"I haven't read the Taylor report".

 

"Nothing will convince me that this disaster was 90% the fault of drunk ticketless fans trying to force their way in"

 

Enough said really. You are free to go on believing whatever you want then mate - regardless of evidence !

Edited by Tomo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"I haven't read the Taylor report".

 

"Nothing will convince me that this disaster was 90% the fault of drunk ticketless fans trying to force their way in"

 

Enough said really. You are free to go on believing whatever you want then mate - regardless of evidence !

 

Talking of evidence. How come Duckenfield was cleared of manslaughter then? 6 weeks of evidence and the guy is not convicted. What does that tell you? Don't just believe the shit that the scousers pedal, why don't you listen to the evidence?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Upcoming Events

    No upcoming events found
  • Live championship table

  • Championship Live Scores

    Fctables
×

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.