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hillsborough

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Bestwood - you keep banging on about the 'ticketless fans' though. As stated above, inquest after enquiry has said that this was not an issue. That was the conclusion based upon a stack of evidence that the various people looked at over a huge amount of time.

 

If there had been hundreds of ticketless fans, surely evidence would have been brought forward by SYP, as this would have substantially helped their case. After their initial claims of ticketless fans in the aftermath of the tragedy, they didn't really make these claims any more.

 

If you honestly believe otherwise, where are you getting that belief from - where is your evidence to prove the 'experts' wrong ?

My belief is from cctv off fans climbing walls and scaling fences to get into the central pens.

 

Do you believe everything that comes from official enquiries?

 

What does it matter anyway? Why can't you and Colin S (member for years but only ever posted on two threads, guess which two?) accept that me and a few others on here don't believe that certain fans were completely blameless? Why do you care so much that I don't believe it?

 

I don't believe OJ Simpson is innocent but he was cleared by a jury, do you fancy kicking off about that too?

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I'm not sure I am kicking off really, but anyway...

 

As I have said over many years, you are perfectly entitled to believe what you want. As a matter of interest, which bit of the CCTV coverage you referred to showed which fans had tickets and which didn't ?

Edited by Tomo

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I'm not sure I am kicking off really, but anyway...

 

As I have said over many years, you are perfectly entitled to believe what you want. As a matter of interest, which bit of the CCTV coverage you referred to showed which fans had tickets and which didn't ?

Ok then not kicking off but why keep commenting. I don't follow the people who believe the report around and keep commenting. It doesn't matter to me either way. I put a 30 minute YouTube link up earlier the thread showing fans climbing walls to get into the stadium. Like I said though it doesn't matter. I believe O J Simpson killed Nicole Brown and her friend, I believe Madeline Mccans parents had something to do with her disappearance but I don't follow those who disagree around. Why do you care so much?

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Erm...I think you will find that you are on this forum as much as me Bestwood, so I could ask the same point.

 

I just find it intriguing why some, albeit now a minority, seem to still hold on their own beliefs about what really happened when the overwhelming weight of evidence is against them..

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Why does it matter to you? Yes I am on this forum a lot but I don't keep arguing with someone who holds different beliefs to me. To be honest me and you normally agree when it comes to things like not all Muslims are terrorists etc but this time we both hold a different view point, so what?

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So you haven't been arguing with me then ?...I would suggest it perhaps takes two :smile_anim:. Very happy to leave the debate with you though !

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So you haven't been arguing with me then ?...I would suggest it perhaps takes two :smile_anim:. Very happy to leave the debate with you though !

Not arguing as I haven't been trying to change your opinion, it doesn't matter to me whether people agree or disagree as long it doesn't resort to name calling like Colin S did. The world, in particular this forum, would be very boring if everyone held the same view!

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As I say I am happy to leave it too, but for the sake of clarity, your posting of videos wasn't designed then in any way to back up your point/make people look at things differently ? Really ?

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You take a snippet of what I say and call me a troll? I have clearly said here all parties are to blame.

 

You only come on this forum to discuss this one topic but you call me a troll?

Because despite the evidence presented in the Taylor report, and now this inquest, you keep blaming the fans when it was entirely down to South Yorkshire Police.

 

iks mentioned it on the other thread that people appear not to be able to admit they are wrong. It takes a man to admit he got it wrong, you keep posting the same mantra in ignorance of the facts. I don't spend too much time on the internet, I only lurk here now and again. But I saw the rubbish being posted on Hillsborough and felt I had to comment.

 

 

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Because despite the evidence presented in the Taylor report, and now this inquest, you keep blaming the fans when it was entirely down to South Yorkshire Police.

 

iks mentioned it on the other thread that people appear not to be able to admit they are wrong. It takes a man to admit he got it wrong, you keep posting the same mantra in ignorance of the facts. I don't spend too much time on the internet, I only lurk here now and again. But I saw the rubbish being posted on Hillsborough and felt I had to comment.

 

 

I've admitted I am wrong many times on this forum, eve ok this thread. I don't however believe fans are entirely blameless. They aren't the only ones to blame either by any stretch.

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Do you believe everything that comes from official enquiries?

You obviously believe all the lies made up by Duckinfield and the Police. Even as the disaster was unfolding the Police were putting out to the media that the fans had broken down the exit gate that Duckinfield ordered open. Listen to John Motson on the commentary.

 

If the Police and Duckinfield had done their jobs properly, nobody would have died that day.

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I've admitted I am wrong many times on this forum, eve ok this thread. I don't however believe fans are entirely blameless. They aren't the only ones to blame either by any stretch.

So despite the Taylor report saying that ticketless fans weren't a factor, and despite this inquest saying that fans were not to blame in any case, you still think they were. You only have to look at the FACTS to see that they weren't. You have no evidence whatsoever to prove that ticketless fans were a factor. There were less people in the stand than the capacity, you do understand what that means don't you ?

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bestwood, I had a few gins last night so I apologise for calling you a troll, I do strongly disagree with your opinions though and think you need to do some research on the facts.

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Bestwood - you keep banging on about the 'ticketless fans' though. As stated above, inquest after enquiry has said that this was not an issue. That was the conclusion based upon a stack of evidence that the various people looked at over a huge amount of time.

 

If there had been hundreds of ticketless fans, surely evidence would have been brought forward by SYP, as this would have substantially helped their case. After their initial claims of ticketless fans in the aftermath of the tragedy, they didn't really make these claims any more.

 

If you honestly believe otherwise, where are you getting that belief from - where is your evidence to prove the 'experts' wrong ?

If there was no ticket less fans at a semi final then its the first one in history . Its akin to saying no fucker had a drink or was pissed and coppers aint lying bastards.

 

I aint going to argue the toss and most right minded people will be the same . I am glad the bereaved families have some kind of closure to this I hope it gives them some kind of peace the poor souls have lived it everyday. , I would find it difficult to argue my point on it as I feel it would show disrespect to them, I was there that day and I know this anyone who was there will never forget it.

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To some degree I feel sorry for some of the ordinary cops on duty on the day. There were apparently plenty who pleaded with senior officers to allow gates to be opened to allow fans out onto the pitch, only for these requests to be denied. We also know there were 160+ police statements altered because rank and file officers had criticised senior officers actions on the day. Again, I suspect it was the senior management most at fault.

 

There were also plenty of tales of ordinary cops trying their best to save lives. Perhaps easy to lose this side of things amidst the understandable condemnation of SYP as an organisation...

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Glad to see the Police Chief has been found not guilty of manslaughter. It's nice to see justice prevail and not the "justice" as perceived by the Scouse mob.

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5 hours ago, Mr Smith said:

Glad to see the Police Chief has been found not guilty of manslaughter. It's nice to see justice prevail and not the "justice" as perceived by the Scouse mob.

The Mickey's are not going to take this result laying down .  You can bet your bottom dollar that there will be a demand for a retrial .. The real question is , how , if at all this will affect any potential compensation claims ?????????????

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